The Gathering

“Copying is stealing”

By Claude “Clayreon” Bosschem and Danny “Camil” Focke. (June 22, 2002)

A long drive to Nijmegen to interview The Gathering, was no problem at all. But Nijmegen is a big town, with a lot of things happening (fairs, markets, traffic jams,…) that get in the way. The search for the right address wasn’t as simple as we thought. After a long search and some luck, we only came a few minutes late for our appointment in the building of Psychonaut Records. Inge (their manager), Anneke Van Giersbergen (vocals) and Hans Rutten (drums) were waiting for us. The singer of Cirrha Niva was also present, but as our time with The Gathering was limited, we will have to interview him another time.

A pity, the EP just came out, so we only received it minutes before the interview. We had no idea of the sound, so we had no questions in that direction.

Prog-nose: Do you consider your music as progressive?

Anneke: It’s hard to say. The name covers a lot.

Hans: The word progressive has everything to do with thinking ahead, searching for new approaches. A band like Marillion is still experimenting. I went to one of their gigs in Geleen, two months ago. It was very good and there were about 2000 people. In Holland, fans are still holding on to Marillion, as maybe they don’t in Belgium.

Prog-nose: The same with Rush, we saw on your site that you are a Rush fan? What do you think about “Vapor Trails”? We think it’s no longer progressive.

Hans: It’s a rock-album. You no longer expect them to record numbers as Xanadu or 2112.

Prog-nose: How would you call your own music style?

Anneke: I would call it “heavy pop”. It has rock, it has pop, it has a little heavy metal, it has so many things, even jazz. It’s very difficult. You can only summarise it in the word pop because it’s popular for a certain group of people.
Hans: Cross-over, film music, atmospheric music.

Prog-nose: The new EP, is it a preview of the full CD or is it something completely apart?

Hans: It is more an “offview” in stead of a preview.
Anneke: Well, that sounds a bit negative.
Hans: We have 12 songs that are going to appear on the full length CD that will be released in January 2003.
These 12 songs match very well together. They create a certain atmosphere, a homogeneity. The 3 songs on the EP didn’t really fit in, in a very positive way. One is a very long epical song (Black Light District), for another we work a lot with tape hooks and cut-ups (Debris). We have been cutting a lot. And there’s also a sort of preview, a piano version of a song that’s going to end up on the full CD.
It has become an EP with songs that wouldn’t have worked on the CD, but we still like them a lot
Anneke: Indeed, they are very good.

Prog-nose:What is the style of the new CD and especially of the full CD? Is it the same as previous albums? I had a feeling there were some alternative sounds in it, but we only heard a short mp3 that’s on your site. Did you ame at a younger public

Anneke: We don’t ame at a certain public. It’s not one of our criteria. We write what’s coming out of us and we try to do that as good as possible. After that we look which atmosphere these songs create. Three songs gave a different feeling. On the full CD, you are going to find numbers that are harder, more emotional, more melancholic. Songs with more vehemence.
We also wanted to make the songs a little shorter, so that they run smoother. It’s possible this is going to work with a bigger public. At that moment, we are thinking a little bit about the public, but the song always has the priority. I don’t really know who’s going to like it. It’s always a gamble.

Prog-nose: So it won’t be a concept-album.

Anneke: The songs need to fit together, but it’s not really a concept.

Prog-nose: Can you tell us something about the guest musicians on the CD?

Hans: First of all there’s Trickster G. If there’s music that deserves the name progressive, it must be his. I strongly advise it. Especially his “Perdition City” album. He comes from the Black Metal scene in Norway. He has evolved into a personal style. It’s no rock, it’s more electronic, it’s the other side of progressivity.
Anneke: Dark atmospheres. And then there is Sarah Jezebel Deva, we met her on tour. She’s doing backing vocals with Therion and she also did some work for Cradle Of Filth. She has a beautiful opera voice, but we only let her speak. She has a lovely voice to listen to and her English accent is excellent.
Hans: Also Denis D’Amour from Voivod will have a guest appearance on the full CD.

Prog-nose: According to your personal lists, you are all fans of Radiohead, but you can’t really hear that in your music.

Anneke: No, but it doesn’t really need to. You can get inspired and give a certain feeling. You don’t have to copy riffs.
Hans: We are trying not to resemble to some other band or music. You must integrate things into your music.

Prog-nose: Maybe you can explain some of the titles of songs ,from your CD, that you already putted on the Internet.

Hans: They are all working titles. Sometimes they have a funny meaning.
”Zion”, for instance, has been broken down and only a loop remained. The loop remained and we have built a completely new song around it.
”Mokaka” is some sort of monkey. So you can see how serious some of these titles are.
Anneke: It’s a very danceable song that has yet a long way to go.
Hans: Certain songs have been omitted. “These good people” no longer exists.
Anneke: “Telson II” has been deleted. “Telson I” will be very beautiful. A modern classical song, with a lot of instruments, very dark.
Hans: “Sleepy Buildings”, “Broken Glass”, “Telson I” will be on the CD. We are still working on “Monsters”. Also “Golden Grounds”, “Even The Spirits Are Afraid”, “Souvenirs” and “We Just Stopped Breathing” will be on the album. They are working titles, drawings. The songs need to have a name. They lead a live of their own.
Anneke: Sometimes a song is finished and we need THE good title. So we have to quarrel a bit about it. We are very sensitive about it. A good title is very difficult. I’m not so good at it.
Prog-nose: Is “Black Light District” the new “How To Measure A Planet”? It’s also a very long number.

Hans: No, they don’t have anything to do with each other. HTMAP is only a song for the first ten minutes, after that it becomes a soundscape. Most people didn’t understand that, they expect it to remain a song. “Black Light District” is much noisier, more guitar oriented.

Prog-nose: Do you know any belgian band in your style?

Anneke: I’m thinking about dEUS and Zita Swoon, we like them very much. It’s alternative music and that fits very well with us. I think that’s a very beautiful, intelligent wave coming out of Belgium.

Prog-nose: What’s your favourite music of the moment?

Anneke: We listen a lot to a CD of Elbow. A very good album.

Prog-nose: How To Measure A Planet also appeared on vinyl. Will your next CD’s come out on vinyl?

Hans: This EP and the next CD will appear on vinyl. We also knew the era of having a large cover in your hand with beautiful artwork. Also the sound on vinyl is a lot warmer

Prog-nose: We think there’s an obvious link between SF & Fantasy and progressive music and certainly between The Gathering and SF & Fantasy
(examples: their name comes from the movie “Highlander”, J.R.R. Tolkien’s voice is on “Sand and Mercury”, “Strange Machines” is based upon The Time Machine from HG Wells, “How To Measure A Planet” is about space,…)

Hans: We don’t really read much fantasy. Only the originals, the first ones to start with something, that’s interesting for me and that’s what I really like. Tolkien has created a new world. After him, there were others who tried the same, but they never reach the same level. They also bring something new, but they are never the pioneer as the first one was. The same for HG Wells, he was the first to write about a time machine. On “How To Measure A Planet” we use pictures of Russian astronauts, they were the pioneers, they were the first. The first “Star Wars” movie was the best, it wasn’t really about the money as the others were. The new “Star Wars” is more a demo for the new Pentium V. There will be a lot of clones of “Harry Potter” but they will never be better.
It can never be the target to play music like Dream Theater. If it is, I don’t carry on. You must make music for yourself, that’s interesting.
Like the early Pink Floyd, they had no examples. They experimented, with a lot of drugs of course, but that’s interesting. It has never been matched afterwards.
Anneke: You don’t even have to try to match yourself. The times are changing, the people are changing, you change yourself, you must go on. And if the fans can’t cope with it, then it’s like that. Like U2, give me a name of another band, who really keeps on improving and renewing from the beginning. There are not a lot of bands who keep on evolving.
Hans: And which bands remain? The ones that keep on developing.
Anneke: They don’t have to make a copy of the first album, because you can keep on playing their first record. Most fans buy the CD after all, out of loyalty.
Hans: Indeed, symfo-fans are very faithful. The metal public are a very loyal public too.

Prog-nose: How do you feel about copying, mp3’s, Napster, bootlegs,…? You already launched a statement on your site?
Anneke: If it’s about a half song, like we put on our site, just to make people buy it, it’s alright. Of course, everyone starts copying and they don’t buy the record any more. That’s the way to kill your bands. The people aren’t even aware of that. Everyone, even my own friends, is burning CD’s. Even if you tell them it’s stealing, they don’t really know what they are doing. Everyone is copied, Mariah Carey as well as The Gathering. You can say, Mariah has money enough, but that doesn’t matter, she also works for her money. You need money to make a new record. It’s very unfair.
It doesn’t happen that much in our style of music because the fans want the artwork and the lyrics and they want to help you, but it still happens too often..
Hans: I don’t really mind bootlegs. Most of the time, they are of a minor quality. Mp3’s are another story, they harm everyone. Eventually there will be less music, because it has become an uncertain business.
Anneke: People make copies because they are lazy and for the money of course. It’s easy to copy. We put the money in it, so you expect people to buy your CD. Record companies and shops make to much out of CD’s, so they should be cheaper. That doesn’t mean you can start stealing from your bands. The price of a CD is a complete other discussion.

Prog-nose: Can you tell us something about your different producers during your career. (Siggi Bemm, Attie Bauw, Zlaya Hadzich)

Hans: Siggi Bemm was not really a producer. He was the one who recorded everything and gave his opinion.
Anneke: He was very German, grundlich.
Hans: Attie Bauw was a real producer. We learned from him how it is to work with a producer. He studied the recording techniques that were used for Radiohead. He made it a specialisation and integrated us into it. Great producer but very expensive. A lot of beautiful things came out of it, maybe we will work with him again in the future. Zlaya was advised to us by Attie, an engineer, very good and very accurate.
He already gave a helping hand on “if_then_else”. Now he’s doing the whole job for this EP and the new CD.
Anneke: Attie was always very neat, completely OK. Also his sound was very neat. Zlaya is more raw and we thought we could use that. A sound with more balls, you can call it. (with a rough edge) He found the perfect combination between recording a solid sound and yet putting an emotion in it. It also gives you new impulses if you take someone new for each CD.

Prog-nose: You have your own label now, Psychonaut records. Is this EP your first release?

Anneke: Indeed, it is our own label. We already re-released our first CD’s (“Always” and “Almost A Dance”) But this EP is our real start.